*President Talabani:* Thank you very much, my dear brother and friend, Elie. I thank you and your /Al-Arabiya/ team for giving me the opportunity to talk frankly to viewers regarding some of the questions you will ask. My health is good. I don't have any basic problem. I underwent at the King Hussein Medical Centre in Jordan with the kindness of King Abdullah. The doctors took great care of me, and the tests showed that I don't have any problem. Lately, to be surer I also underwent tests in the United States and the results were the same. As for the rumors, as you know there are many rumors in Iraq -from the president to the government...
*Nakuzi:* Then it is just a matter of fatigue and not a particular disease?
*President: *I have no disease other than obesity. I have to lose weight. I am now on a strict diet.
*Nakuzi:* I hope we will not exhaust you with questions.
*President: * God willing, no. I am at your disposal.
*Nakuzi: *You are generous hearted, and one cannot exhaust you.
*President: *For me your questions are definitely delightful.
*Nakuzi*: Mam Jalal, we begin with what is being said recently about Mam Jalal's unjustified and incomprehensible -for some people - closeness to Iran and before that to Syria, at a time when everyone today views Iran as the cause of a crisis. It supports Hamas in Palestine and Hezbollah in Lebanon. It supports -as the Americans say -extremist militias in Iraq. What is this rapprochement? Such rapprochement on Mam Jalal's part is not understandable.
*President: * First, I want to say to you that my policy is to have rapprochement with all neighboring countries. I began it with fraternal Arab states. The first state I visited was the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan, then Egypt, and then Saudi Arabia, and I have a strong desire to revisit Egypt. I have also visited Turkey , Iran, and Syria.
What you mentioned about my interest in Iraq and Syria is due to my belief that if we succeeded in winning over Syria and Iran to support Iraq in fighting terror, the task of eliminating terrorism will become 70 per cent easier. That is why we are anxious to have dialogue and negotiations with the brothers in Iran and Syria in order to gain their assistance in fighting terror in Iraq.
*Nakuzi:* Iran and Syria are responsible for 70 per cent of the terrorism in the country?
*President: * I am not saying that. That's what you are saying. I am saying that Iran and Syria can help us to eliminate 70 per cent of the terrorism in Iraq. The other point is that Iran can help us in silencing or rehabilitating certain militias that have links with Iran and which create problems for us -actually sectarian problems. Some of those militias used to create problems for us: when a booby-trapped car blows up in a Shi'i area killing innocent women, children, clerics, and students, some of those militias used to take revenge against Sunni Arabs. That created a kind of sectarian sedition. Now, with Iranian efforts, and as a result of a fatwa by His Eminence Al-Sayyid Ali al-Sistani, the high Shi'i religious authority, and also thanks to a statement from Sayyid Muqtada al-Sadr, such actions have been stopped. That means the danger of sectarian civil war has gone. Efforts are now focused on imposing the law on terrorists and on those who violate the law from the other side, be it Sunni or Shi'i.
*Nakuzi:* Every day we hear from senior US Army general and we see on television reports on bombings in which sophisticated devices are used, and it is said they are all from Iran and they are all used for terrorist purposes in Iraq.
*President: *Yes, the Americans say that. We also ask for clarifications from the Iranian brothers on those matters. They say "we did not provide those explosives but they took them from other quarters to which we had supplied the explosives". They [Iranians] deny such matters and they say to us they are prepared to cooperate with the Americans and with the Iraqi side to form a trilateral committee that assumes the task of imposing security and stability in Iraq, and they pledge to be an important factor in imposing security and stability and eliminating Al-Qaeda if the Americans and Iraqis agree to the formation of such a trilateral committee.
*Nakuzi:* There are those who say that Iran today does not want stability in Iraq, Lebanon, or Palestine as long as it has not resolved the nuclear dossier with the Americans, and that those are pressure cards. Does President Talabani accept Iraq to be one of the pressure cards on the Americans?
*President: *No, we categorically reject the use of Iraq as a pressure card on the Americans, but we believe that Iran's stand in Iraq is different from its stand in Lebanon and Palestine. That is why I believe they are prepared to contribute to the achievement of security and stability in Iraq. That is why they have offered to participate in a trilateral US-Iranian-Iraqi committee or a bilateral Iranian-Iraqi committee to help in bringing about stability and security in Iraq.
*Nakuzi: *Mr. President, You have also made an attempt with the Syrians -there are reports that Syria is also contributing to Iraq's instability, but they did not give you anything. You came back empty-handed.
*President: *I am sorry to agree to your view. I regret that the Syrian brothers did not give us what we had expected of them.
*Nakuzi:* Why?
*President: *Actually, I am accustomed to not commenting negatively on the Syrian stand, because we owe Syria many favors as you know. We lived for a long time in Syria. I believe some brothers in Syria have illusions regarding the possibility of reviving the old Ba'th Party or its playing a role.
*Nakuzi:* They still have dreams?
*President: *I think so. Some elements encourage certain quarters to convene a conference in Damascus to form a so-called Islamic National Front against Iraq. And that is regrettable. I hope brother Dr Bashar will prevent such anti-Iraq activity.
*Nakuzi:* Can I deduce from what we have said so far that Talabani's rapprochement with the Iranians does not mean an estrangement from the Arabs?
*President: * On the contrary. I hope and work for the strengthening of Iraqi-Arab relations, and I give priority to such a relationship. As you know, the first country I visited was Jordan, then Egypt, then Saudi Arabia, and we have made great efforts with those states and we continue to make such efforts. I hope to visit Egypt soon. All those efforts are in order to strengthen Arab-Iraqi relations. Iraq must strive to strengthen its relations with its Arab surroundings. Iraq is an active member of the Arab League, and it must play an important role in the Arab League. Therefore, Iraq cannot live without cooperation and solidarity with the Arabs.
*Nakuzi:* What about that famous speech which some Arabs considered to be an attack on them?
*President: * I think that famous speech is there in both Arabic and English. And there was an Egyptian delegation present, as well as a Lebanese delegation. It did not contain any attack on the Arabs. However, Al-Jazeera -as usual -distorted the speech. I said the following: Iraq is being invaded by terrorists who are coming from various countries -I listed Morocco, Libya, Egypt, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Palestine, Syria, and so on. That's all what I said. Regarding the stand of states on terrorism I said the following, and I quote: "The laxity of anti-democratic states opposed to a democratic federal Iraq with the terrorists." I said the terrorists benefit form such laxity.
*Nakuzi:* Who did you mean?
*President: *It's well known. I gave reasons. First I said there are states that are hostile to democracy in Iraq. There are states that are hostile to Kurdish nationalism in Iraq. There are states that are hostile to the Shi'is in Iraq. There are states that fear the establishment of a democratic, independent, and unified Iraq that changes the balance of power in the Middle East. It is my custom not to name states, but everyone will understand what I am saying. I did not mention the name of any Arab state, although we have many documents about much interference. However we prefer to resolve such issues in bilateral meetings with those states and in brotherly discussions, and not through the media and by slandering.
*Nakuzi:* To end this issue, Mr. President, it is said that the Iranians as well as the Syrians did not give you anything, and your rapprochement with them will entail a high price for you on the Arab level, and the Iranians will not give you anything?
*President: *I don't know if they will give us anything or not. However, we do not have relations with Iran and Syria to be against the Arabs. Syria is an Arab state. It is not a Persian state. Relations with Syria mean in another sense relations with the Arabs, some of the Arabs. We did not boycott the Arabs. We at the same time seek to establish the best of relations with the Arabs. When I was in China I sent a special representative to Cairo to meet with some Egyptian brothers to coordinate with them, and to pave the way for the visit I will be making to Egypt. Actually my visit to Iran took place on my way back from China. I went to visit His Eminence Sayyid Abd-al-Aziz al-Hakim [Iraqi Islamic Supreme Council chairman who is in hospital in Tehran]. I stayed one night, and the Iranian brothers arranged for me a meeting with the Supreme Guide [Ayatollah Ali Khamene'i], the president [Mahmud Ahmadinezhad], and the foreign minister [Manuchehr Mottaki] and so on. Our relationship with Iran is not against our relationship with the Arabs. On the contrary, we have sought and we seek and we will make many efforts to improve relations with the Arabs. I personally have good relations with some Arab states, including the elder sister Egypt. Why is the improvement of relations with Iran and Syria construed as though it is directed against the Arabs? Is not Syria an Arab state?
*Nakuzi:* There is Iranian talk that if there is a US military strike against Iran there will be destruction in the Gulf, and all the Arab states will be bombed...
*President: *Yes, does Jalal Talabani's visit to Iran prevent a US strike against Iran? Or if Jalal Talabani visits Iran will there be destruction in the Gulf region?
*Nakuzi:* Perhaps the brothers in the Gulf expect a sympathetic stand?
*President: *With whom?
*Nakuzi:* By Jalal Talabani -with them.
*President: * At the Arab summit we expressed sympathy with Gulf issues, and we supported the UAE's claims to the islands [Greater Tunb, Lesser Tunb, and Abu Musa] -and that is what the other states have done -whereas they did not reciprocate by showing sympathy with Iraq.
*Nakuzi:* Therefore, it is Jalal Talabani who is blaming some of the Gulf states.
*President: *Yes. For instance, our prime minister wanted to visit the UAE. The UAE refused to receive him. Why? The prime minister of a major state such as Iraq, whose government is freely elected? We want to improve relations with the UAE. We do not send the prime minister to beg. We send him to improve relations. They refused to receive him. Isn't this blameworthy?
*Nakuzi:* Did you talk to them?
*President: *How can I, if they refuse to receive our prime minister?
*Nakuzi:* We'll stop for a break, and then I'll continue with this subject and with the domestic Iraqi issue -Sunnis, Shi'is, Kurds -the oil bill, the armament of Sunnis and the tribes in Iraq, and if that mean the final partition of Iraq into three statelets as is happening in Palestine today, similar to the way matters are heading in Lebanon today. After the break, Mr. President.
*Nakuzi:* We will continue with the interview with President Jalal Talabani. You are blaming the UAE for not receiving Prime Minister Al-Maliki. The UAE has a stand: it had opened all the doors to Prime Minister Al-Maliki but he got closer to Iran and abandoned the Arabs. That is not an official stand but that is what is said in the lobbies.
*President: *I will tell you something. Dr Nuri al-Maliki is at a distance form Iran. His relationship with Iran is not good, for your information. Dr Al-Maliki has lived throughout his period of exile in Syria, not in Iran. Dr Al-Maliki is a pan-Arabist and makes every effort to strengthen Iraq's Arab relations. Would not it not have been better if they received him and blamed him if they have anything to blame Iraq for, or reveal to him the secret of the Iraqi stand . Iraq has not reciprocated Iran's stand and has not supported Iran's stand in the Gulf. Iraq supported the Gulf stand on the islands issue, and stood with them. However, as you know, the refusal to receive the prime minister of a major state such as Iraq is a big thing.
*Nakuzi:* Yes. Anyway, of course...
*President: * Brother Eli, I'll tell you one thing. All of us in Iraq are very anxious to strengthen Arab-Iraqi relations. We were chided by Turkey because we agreed to holding the conference in Sharm al-Sheikh and not in Istanbul, because the Turks wanted the conference to be held there. We show no interest in anything that obstructs our relations with the Arabs. On the contrary, we seek by every means to improve those relations, but one hand cannot clap by itself -regrettably it is not possible.
*Nakuzi:* Therefore, this is the launching of an initiative?
*President: *We are ready -myself, the prime minister -to visit any Arab country that has problems with us in order to solve them, and to reassure them completely that Iraq is interested in its Arab relations and is anxious to have good relations with its Arab surroundings...
*Nakuzi:* Against the Arabs?
*President: * And will not take any stand against the Arabs, and will not stand with any state -even a Great Power -against the Arabs.
*Nakuzi:* Here I move to the external dossier. There is also a problem today with the Turks. It was reported yesterday that there are 200,000 peshmergas stationed along the border with Turkey, and there is a threat of a Turkish incursion. How true are such reports, and are there 200,000 fully armed peshmergas?
*President: *There isn't such a number of peshmergas on the border.
*Nakuzi:* But is there such a number of peshmergas?
*President: *No. There is no massing of Kurdish fighters on the border with Turkey. On the contrary, there is massing of Turkish troops on the border . We have sought and continue to seek to strengthen Iraqi-Turkish relations. We helped the Turkish government a great deal. Perhaps, dear brother, you are unaware that there are now Turkish forces in the Bamirni area in Iraqi Kurdistan, and that they have been there for a long time -tanks and a company of troops to observe the Iraqi-Turkish border from inside Iraq, to observe PKK activity. There is also a Turkish military mission in Arbil, and a Turkish military mission in Al-Sulaymaniyah.
*Nakuzi:* What is this talk about an incursion and an attack?
*President: *Let me continue. That is why in practice we facilitate matters for the Turkish brothers, but we are unable now to send Iraqi forces to the mountains of Kurdistan. We need those forces to secure the streets of Baghdad. However, we -our Constitution -reject the presence of foreign armed forces on Iraqi territory. Any foreign armed group must -according to the Constitution -leave Iraq. When we can enforce the law we will drive out every foreign armed group from Iraqi territory. We in Iraq tried through the tripartite US-Turkish-Iraqi committee to reach a result with the Turkish brothers. However, the Turkish brothers refused to attend the meeting. Do you know the pretext? Because the three-member Iraqi delegation included a Kurd. If they reject the presence of a Kurd in the Iraqi delegation then they must refuse to deal with Iraq, because in Iraq the president is a Kurd, the foreign minister is a Kurd, and the chairman of the Economic Commission -your friend Barham Salih -is a Kurd. How can a state have such logic as to reject dialogue and discussion with a delegation because it includes a person from a particular Iraqi ethnic group?
*Nakuzi:* They do not recognize the region as an existing region...That is still a problem?
*President: * Yes, they do not recognize. They have the right to recognize or not to recognize. That is a matter that concerns them. However, we did not say they should negotiate with the region. We said that they negotiate with the Iraqi government.
*Nakuzi:* Is there going to be an incursion?
*President: *I don't think there will be an incursion. They threaten an incursion. I think it is electioneering. There is a desire that the extremist nationalists will win in the elections by stirring up nationalist sentiments against the Justice and Development Party and consequently I think it is election propaganda more than a realistic possibility. I want to say one thing to you: At a special session the leader of the socialist bloc in the EU parliament said to Deniz Baykal , leader of the Republican People's Party: "Understand that your incursion into northern Iraq is a disaster for Turkey and Iraq, because all of Europe and America will stand against you. " I believe the Turkish brothers will not gamble on the military option.
*Nakuzi:* Are the Kurds prepared? Are the Kurds in Kurdistan prepared for any incursion, or are they today preoccupied with domestic issues. We know there are many peshmergas in Baghdad helping your forces?
*President: *We hope there will be no Turkish incursion into Iraq. We hope there will be no fighting between us and our brothers in Turkey. However, an incursion into Iraqi Kurdistan will not be a picnic. If the incursion is into the Qandil Mountains area where the PKK forces are then that is one thing, and if the incursion is into areas inside Iraqi Kurdistan -into the cities and towns then there will definitely be a clash between the peshmerga forces and the Turkish army, and this is something we do not wish for at all.
*Nakuzi:* Mr. President, let me move to the domestic issue. Today we hear a great deal about this government. Some people are saying this government is faltering and failing, while some are talking about coups against this government and against Nuri al-Maliki personally. How do you today assess Nuri al-Maliki's stage, and do you believe -frankly Mr. President -that Al-Maliki has failed to fulfill his promises to the Iraqi people?
*President: * First, I believe Dr Al-Maliki has accomplished big achievements. He has called for national reconciliation and has taken big strides in that regard. He has even gone as far as to negotiate with armed Iraqi groups. I have heard a statement by one of those armed groups after meeting with Dr Al-Maliki and it described him as highly patriotic and that he has a great sense of responsibility. I believe that is an important step for no one other than Al-Maliki had dared to contact those who are fighting the Iraqi army and the Iraqi authorities.
Second, Al-Maliki confronted the Shi'i militias that tried to tamper, such as Jund al-Sama [Soldiers of Heaven], for instance, and others. He did not accept any violation of the law by Shi'i militias in southern Iraq. Battles erupted in Al-Diwaniyah and Basra between the Iraqi forces and Shi'i militias -in the sense that Al-Maliki has demonstrated he is not sectarian.
*Nakuzi:* Therefore the accusations of sectarianism that are leveled against him are not true?
*President: * The accusation that Al-Maliki is sectarian is a false and unjust accusation. However, I am not claiming the government succeeded in achieving all of its program. The government did not succeed in achieving all of its program for the simple reason that there is no collective leadership for the state in Iraq. That is a big shortcoming. The presidency works on one side, the premiership works on another side, and the ministries work on a different side. We in Iraq need a collective leadership. It comprises the presidency and the Cabinet, and assumes responsibility for administering the state and solving all of Iraq's problems. That in my view is the key to solving the crises in Iraq.
*Nakuzi:* Will it happen?
*President: *Yes, yes. Agreement has been reached between the presidency council and the premiership on establishing a quartet office to carry out this task. We are now drawing up a program for that office and are defining it in writing. We are working accordingly so as to implement the political program on which agreement was reached prior to the formation of the government and also to apply the Constitution. We believe this quartet office should also be constitutional, because the Constitution states that the executive authority comprises the presidency and the premiership.
*Nakuzi:* Who is the quartet then? The president...
*President: * And the two vice presidents and the prime minister.
*Nakuzi:* Yes?
*President: * We have also decided to activate the political council of the national security council and form a secretariat for it, and draw up a program for it, and vice- presidents Tariq al-Hashimi and Adil Abd-al-Mahdi, and Ruz Shawais have been assigned to prepare a program for the council. Therefore we are taking steps forward in that regard.
*Nakuzi:* Who is responsible for the political problems in the country?
*President: *I'll give you an example. Some problems occur impulsively. Let's take the latest crisis with the brothers in the Al-Tawafuq who suspended their membership of the Council of Representatives because a minister's home was raided by the police. I oppose that raid. The minister is in the government. The prime minister promised to temporarily halt legal measures against him, and to refer the case to the judiciary. Why should the police have the right to storm a minister's home, break down the doors, and search his papers. He is a minister who enjoys immunity and the prime minister did not approve such a measure against him. This led to the brothers in Al-Tawafuq protesting such action. Those matters can be resolved if collective leadership is activated. Such matters - for instance a minister accused of killing two sons of the MP, Mithal al-Alusi -can be left to the collective leadership to discuss how to resolve it. I am a lawyer and I believe in the rule of law. The law must be enforced on every person, whoever he may be. Once the prime minister told me there is a claim against a former Kurdish minister who I love and respect and he asked me my view. I said refer him to a judiciary investigation. If the investigation finds something against him send him to court, but if it does not find anything against him close the case. He carried out a judiciary investigation and it transpired that the accused minister is innocent and the case was closed.
Such actions must not be carried out. Then there is the case of the speaker of the Council of Representatives Mahmud Mashhadani. It is true that the speaker is not balanced, and every day he makes statements. For instance once he says that I am his father and leader and then he insults me. However, the way of tackling his presence in parliament was wrong.
*Nakuzi:* I thought you were happy.
*President: * No, I am not happy. When an action is illegal I am not happy. I said the following to them: This man is dotard. Before taking action parliament should ask the Iraqi judiciary: What is the legal stand towards him? If the judiciary says he can be deposed by a vote of no confidence then parliament should do so. Otherwise, without sanction from a legal authority it is not right. He has become bad tempered. He has ordered that an MP be beaten up, and when he lost his temper he ordered that an MP be removed, thus creating an unfriendly atmosphere in parliament. My view is that the matter could have been solved amicably and legally.
*Nakuzi:* All the parties are...
*President: * I believe all the parties were disturbed by the behavior of the speaker of parliament. When there was a vote in parliament to give him a one-week period of grace, it was a unanimous vote. However, by taking measures...
*Nakuzi:* These are formalities. That is the basis of the problem in Iraq?
*President: *Allow me to continue. We suffer from another problem. Within the Al-Tawafuq bloc there are elements linked to the resistance. For instance, there is one MP called Abd-al-Nasir al-Janabi. The prime minister said in parliament that he has evidence that Abd-al-Nasir al-Janabi is linked to the insurgents and the fighting against the government. Of course no action was taken against him. After some time he went to Jordan, tendered his resignation from parliament, and declared that he is joining the isurgents. That is one of the Al-Tawafuq MPs. There are also others who publicly support violence. We have the leader of a bloc, Mish'an al-Juburi, who was removed and was replaced by Husayn al-Juburi from the same bloc.
We also have some problems created by the Al-Tawafuq. Our brothers in Al-Tawafuq must be patient and avoid such actions that harm them more than others. For instance, Khalaf Ulayyan says "we have made demands, and if our demands are not met we will declare" resistance and war." Is this what an MP should say? If our demand is not accepted.. He should say we will go to parliament, we will call for a vote of no confidence in the government -he should resort to constitutional means. But to say we declare "war and resistance"? What are such threats? Are these the words of a politician in this democratic era in which he can say such things? The best proof there is a democratic climate is that he is an MP and he wants to declare war on the government. That is also something that should be dealt with by the brothers in Al-Tawafuq, and also by the government.
Personally I am always inclined towards the need to have our Sunni Arab brothers genuinely and really share in making political decisions in administering the state. They should not be a marginalized force or merely a force represented in the posts. They must be represented in the centre of decision-making, where political decisions should be made with their participation and in their presence, otherwise Iraq will not be stable. Iraq is based on three pillars: Shi'i Arabs, Sunni Arabs, and the Kurds. If one of the pillars falls, Iraq falls.
*Nakuzi:* I will pause for the final break, Mr. President, and then we will delve deeper into those political problems, and your vision for a solution, if these are really problems of formalities, after we delve into the essence of the problem in Iraq.
*Nakuzi:* We will continue with the last part of the "/Frankly Speaking/" interview today with the Iraqi president. Mam Jalal, when you heard there is a plan to arm the Sunni tribes and clans, did you agree to it, and do you believe it is a correct decision?
*President: *I have not heard that decision. I am one of those who made the decision, but in the following form: That the clans that are loyal to the new government are armed alongside the presence of the police and the army -that is the clans should not be the only side that has power in the area. They should be part of the Iraqi forces: the army and the police. That is necessary in order to fight the terrorists, because the Sunni Arab areas had embraced the terrorists. Eliminating those areas of the terrorists is carried out by the armed forces and by the tribal forces and the inhabitants who oppose terror. Another reason is that the Sunni Arab brothers must not feel they are marginalized or threatened by armed forces while they are unarmed. I believe the measure has produced good results, and the present situation in Al-Anbar is the best proof of that for we see that terror has diminished there, and that large areas have been liberated with the assistance of the army, the armed forces, and the tribal forces. However, the arming must not be carried out by the coalition forces, but should be undertaken by the Iraqi government forces.
*Nakuzi:* But the Iraqi government came to disband the militias, not to create new militias?
*President: *These are not militias. The militias are something else. The militias are organized armed forces that belong to specific parties and quarters. Those forces belong to the Iraqi government in their areas. They are civil forces that do not constitute militias but constitute self-defense forces. As soon as terrorism is eliminated those forces will be merged either in the army or the police, or they will be disbanded. For your information, those matters took place as follows: In some areas police centers were opened and the sons of the tribes enlisted in them -they became regular policemen and part of the Iraqi police force.
*Nakuzi:* A kind of self-defense?
*President: *Yes, that is necessary because the army cannot remain in every village and city because when an area is pacified and the armed forces return to their barracks the terrorists return to that area. Arming the inhabitants against them is a basic condition for eliminating terror.
*Nakuzi:* Mr. President, you gave me the example of Khalaf Ulayyan, the MP, who said "we will resist and fight". What if the government should make a decision which those tribes and clans do not like and they turn to insurgency?
*President: * I believe that when terrorism is eliminated no one can stand against the law. When terrorism is eliminated there is no other force capable of engaging in an armed confrontation with the government. Khalaf Ulayyan cannot carry out armed insurgency It is a hollow threat. It is said his son leads one of the insurgent factions. If he chooses he can also lead another insurgent faction -no more than that. However, I cited the example of Mr. Khalaf Ulayyan for two reasons: to show you the extent of democracy that exists in Iraq, when an MP threatens to fight the government. Second, to demonstrate that the brothers in Al-Tawafuq must control their members so that they speak in a disciplined and constitutional manner that is in accordance with the law and the Constitution and that does not violate the laws of the country.
*Nakuzi:* However, they say that what is happening is a reaction to the Iraqi government's behavior, and that is why it is always not an action but a reaction by the Sunni brothers...?
*President: *What is that behavior that gives rise to such reaction?
*Nakuzi:* They say the government is sectarian and takes a sectarian attitude towards everything taking place in Iraq...?
*President: *That is not true. That is an unjust accusation.
*Nakuzi*: That is a view?
*President: *No, it is a wrong view. It is groundless. The government is not sectarian. The government has shortcomings. The government has made mistakes, but not on a sectarian basis -the government's mistakes are based on a lack of realization of the key to the solution in Iraq.
*Nakuzi:* What is it?
*President: *The key to the solution is first a collective leadership of the Iraqi State...
*Nakuzi: *Shi'is and Kurds?
*President: *The collective leadership of the Iraqi State comprises the representatives of Sunni Arabs, Shi'i Arabs, and Kurds. Its constitutional representation should be: the presidency and the prime minister who, according to the Constitution, form the executive authority. The quartet office -which jokingly I call the "gang of four" (an allusion to Mao's China)-can be the collective leadership of the Iraqi State. That is the first condition. The second condition is to form the moderates' national political front [jabhat al-mu'tadilin al-siyasiyah al-wataniyah] so as to rise from the level of sectarian and nationalist seclusion to the national Iraqi level. The third condition is that everyone -and I mean everyone, all sides -shoulders their responsibility in confronting terror and the problems in a joint manner so as to rid Iraq of those problems. Thus no one side can only ask for rights without carrying out duties.
I believe that is the solution, and it is possible, and we are about to implement it now. Serious efforts are taking place in that respect. Then there will be no reason for the Sunni Arab brothers to complain that they are being marginalized and that they are not participating in the administration of the State. I believe and I work for the need to ensure the participation of the real representatives of Sunni Arabs in the administration of the State and in making major decisions in view of the fact they are a basic component of Iraqi society, and so as to make them feel that they are really engaged in governing, making decisions, and drawing national policies and not merely holding government posts. With regard to government posts we can say they have enough posts, but with regard to the actual exercise of power they must be present and effective, and that is a basic condition for the progress of Iraq and the success of the national unity government led by brother Nuri al-Maliki.
*Nakuzi: *Mr. President, there is also a big debate on the oil bill. First, why this US insistence to have the bill passed -an insistence which some people view as suspicious? Will the bill be passed in your view?
*President: *For your information, the bill was fiercely discussed in the Cabinet, and it was unanimously approved by the Cabinet. Even the brothers who are now expressing reservations on the bill -initially the Kurds had reservations on some points, and the Kurds subsequently withdrew their reservations, and there was unanimity on the bill. This is a good law. It tackles basic issues: first central investment. When the provinces conclude contracts the final decision is for the central government. Second, there is a distribution of wealth among all Iraq's areas and governorates in accordance with the proportion of the population and the needs of the region. Third, it attaches importance to the Iraqi National Oil Company and to the Iraqi government.
Therefore there is no justification for opposing the bill. In my view, this bill is necessary for the following reasons: First, to encourage foreign companies to come to Iraq to participate in investment. We need to renew our oil institutions. We have 40 or more oil fields that are not being exploited. We can benefit form those fields to increase production and to increase Iraq's national wealth and we have a great need for funds to reconstruct and rebuild the infrastructure in Iraqi society. Thus there is no justification for opposing the bill. It is true the Americans want to expedite this matter so as to encourage companies to...
*Nakuzi:* And in your view it will be passed next week?
*President: * Yes, it will be passed, because the basic forces agree to it.
*Nakuzi: *Some quick questions at the end of this interview, Mr. President?
*President: *Yes.
*Nakuzi: *With regard to the security plan, during an interview with General Petraeus he promised he will try to achieve some success. The final report will be in September. Do you believe some success has been achieved with regard to the security plan?
*President: *Yes, it achieved big successes.
*Nakuzi:* How?
*President: *First, a great part of Baghdad has become secure. Many of the areas that were plagued with terrorism are now safe. The number of booby-trapped cars was 12 to 14 a day, while now it is 1 to 2 a day in Baghdad. The number of terrorists in the region has greatly decreased, and now if they are present their presence is secret and not public. After that, success was achieved in the Al-Anbar, and now success is being achieved in the Diyala area. Success has been achieved in Kirkuk by ridding the city of many terrorist gangs. Of course, the second stage has begun, and the third stage will come. I believe that ultimately success will be achieved, although shortcomings exist. I believe the plan has shortcomings. We in the presidency have expressed observations on eliminating those shortcomings in order to ensure the plan's success and to implement it. However, the plan deserves to be supported and blessed, and God willing it will succeed. The Iraqi forces have begun to make more preparations.
I will give you an example of our preparations. The Iraqi police force need light weapons such as Kalashnikovs, BKCs, [PKMS 7.62 mm machineguns], and RPGs. Russia had refused to supply us, China agreed. During my latest visit we concluded an agreement with China to supply the Iraqi security forces with light weapons. Those forces will be equipped with those weapons within two months and they will be capable of confronting the terrorists in all areas. In some areas there are 2,000 policemen but only 100 policemen have weapons. When 2,000 policemen are armed the situation will have changed.
*Nakuzi*: I want to thank you, Mr. President...
*President *: I thank you very much for coming, and I wish you will visit us once every month.
*Nakuzi: *Laughs
*President: * " Zooruna": Visit us...( a pun on a Lebanese song "Visit us once a year")
*Nakuzi:* Once a year.
*President: *No, once a month.
*Nakuzi:* Thank you.
*President: *My greetings to Mr Abd-al-Rahman al-Rashid. I wish you every success.
*Nakuzi: *I also thank the viewers who watched us. We will meet in "/Speaking Frankly"/ next week. Goodbye.
*Al-Arabiya TV, *Dubai, in Arabic* July 6, 2007*
[Text translated from the original Arabic]
<http://www.kurd.org/> 
